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ConqSoft
December 11th, 2004, 08:41 AM
I'm almost sold. Just have one question. This may be answered somewhere, but I didn't see it, so I apologize in advance if it has.

PhotoPost has the "Member Galleries" section where each user has their own personal gallery, where they can upload images and create their own sub-categories/etc. I didn't see in vBa Gallery where it had this feature without the admin manually creating each user's gallery. In PhotoPost, it's "built-in" so that each user has their personal gallery.

Thanks.

Fiber
December 11th, 2004, 09:27 AM
Yes vBa Gallery has this. You just have to set a few option in the admin area. They can make their gallery private or open for others. Unless you are refering to the whole page being their own as if it looked like their own webpage. They have to go to your sites main gallery page and then go to their gallery.

Simplicity
December 11th, 2004, 09:57 AM
From what I have seen, this gallery has most of the same major features of PhotoPost, only missing statistics (which I expect will be available as a modification soon) and also provides much much better and easier to manager forum integration.

Brian
December 11th, 2004, 10:41 AM
vBa Gallery does have a way to add member's categories, but it's not the same as PhotoPost's. With vBa Gallery, you can set any category you would like and allow users to create sub-categories in that category which they will have more control over and can upload their images. PhotoPost just has one member's category and if I remember correclty (though I may not) it doesn't give users the ability to create their sub-categories, only upload their images to the member's category and it automatically creates one sub-category for each member.

ConqSoft
December 11th, 2004, 04:48 PM
PhotoPost lets you assign a category as a "Member Area", then each user gets their own Gallery in that one, as soon as they visit. Then, they can create sub-categories under that to organize their images if they like.

I don't want users to be able to create bottom level categories. I want them to have their own, using their username, automatically. Then the ability to create more under that if they wish.

Example: http://www.photopostdev.com/photopost/index.php

The Members Galleries is the functionality I'm looking for.

ConqSoft
December 11th, 2004, 08:17 PM
Well, I think I'm going to buy it anyway. It still appears to be a better product than PhotoPost, and much more tightly integrated with vBulletin.

Now I own all the vBadvanced products. :D

mattster2002
December 11th, 2004, 08:35 PM
Yep it has that feature :)
And its sick.
http://m1.mumsweb.com/gallery for my gallery ;)

MonsterMaxx
December 20th, 2004, 11:59 AM
Can you have one image and multiple catagories?

Say for example it's a car website and the image is of a car with a cool paintjob and killer wheels. As peeps are surfing catagories I'd like this same image to show up in Paint and Wheels.

Possible? Hack or builtin?

ConqSoft
December 20th, 2004, 12:01 PM
Can you have one image and multiple catagories?

Say for example it's a car website and the image is of a car with a cool paintjob and killer wheels. As peeps are surfing catagories I'd like this same image to show up in Paint and Wheels.

Possible? Hack or builtin?

You currently can't assign an image to multiple categories. (He might have that planned for the future; dunno.)

TheGunOwner
December 20th, 2004, 12:49 PM
I've used both Photopost and vbagallery. vbagallery is by far the better product if you have vbulletin. I've also setup a members area gallery with no problem :)

StewardManscat
December 30th, 2004, 07:56 PM
Disagree. I had a quick look at your members section, and it doesn't match up well with photopost at all (feature for feature).

The latest version of Photopost (4.85) integrates seamlessly with vb (it was the thrust of that release). The template and admin systems are different of course, and that's a downside if you require total integration. But Photopost is a far more mature product (Hey, it was born earlier).

I could find no way to offer the same features for adult/dating/member-central sites using gallery. The live demo here is misleading, because there is less than a page of members. Add thousands of members and it is unwieldy.

At Photopost, for twice the price you'll get more than twice the features. For low-maintenance high-volume "member-centric" sites those features are essential.

Gallery will catch up eventually, and I'll be here when it does, because there is no 'integration' --it is vb all the way.

At this point, gallery has more to offer vb webmasters and moderators. Photopost has far more to offer the users. I purchased gallery, but in the end chose to remain in the Photopost camp.

ConqSoft
December 30th, 2004, 08:01 PM
StewardManscat,

I agree, but, as we know, PhotoPost has been around a long time, and Gallery is still in RC.

I'm in the same boat with you. I'm keeping PhotoPost right now, but plan to switch to Gallery in the future.

Brian has been working diligently on every concern I've had in relation to the switchover from PhotoPost, so I'm sure Gallery will "get there".

But, as you said, PhotoPost is a more feature-rich and mature product at this point in the game.

rbl
December 30th, 2004, 09:52 PM
At this point, gallery has more to offer vb webmasters and moderators. Photopost has far more to offer the users.

I guess it depends on how you use your software. Right now Gallery enables me to offer a much more complete site to my users, than the one I can offer with PP. Of course there are basic things still missing (http://www.vbadvanced.com/forum/showthread.php?p=23248) but hey, it's still a RC, right?

So, if you mean user experience, I disagree.
If you mean something like "Gallery has not the same user content pages", I agree with you.

In comparison:
- A member's gallery in PP (showgallery.php/ppuser/userid/) is far more complete than the equivalent simple page in Gallery (browseimages.php?do=member&imageuser=userid);
- PP's profile page (member.php?uid=userid) has far more info than Gallery's My Subscriptions page (browseimages.php?do=subscriptions);
- And the Member's Galleries in PP (showmembers.php) is of no match to Gallery's Member's Categories.

But I ask, so what?
Those are only pages. Even I with my crummy php knowledge could make the appropriate changes to browseimages.php to match PP's member gallery page.

The permissions system in Gallery is far more versatile than the one found on Photopost. Tweaking category and usergroup permissions allows me to give zero permissions in one category to a user and full permissions in the next. Add to this users' owned categories and single category moderator privs. and you have enough options to create a very diversified site.
You can't do that with PP. Not without a lot of hacking.

ConqSoft
December 30th, 2004, 10:01 PM
I prefer PP's method of member galleries. Where they can create their own albums under their gallery only, and not be able to just create their own named galleries at the "root" of the member area. That's the main thing I was wanting Brian to add.

Brian
December 30th, 2004, 11:48 PM
At Photopost, for twice the price you'll get more than twice the features. For low-maintenance high-volume "member-centric" sites those features are essential.
I'd like to know how you can say twice the features. At the moment, vBa Gallery lacks a few features that PP has, but certainly not twice as many. vBa Gallery also has many features that PP doesn't offer, and RC3 will have about 30 new options/features as well. ;)

rbl
December 30th, 2004, 11:59 PM
Brian, it's the second time you mention the 30 new features. Can you lift the curtain a bit? =)

Zachery
December 31st, 2004, 12:09 AM
You want him to spend time elaborating or coding ;)

V-Rodforums
December 31st, 2004, 12:09 AM
Well I hate to piss on anyone but having used photopost for a couple of years and now vba on both of my forums the difference to me is

PP has almost daily updates with poor documentation and for a novice every update is like a nightmare. The styles don't match well and you can count on that email from that new member that has never logged out to tell you that he can't view images.

VBA while not having as many options was a breeze to install, no double admin panel. The styles look perfect, data base integration was perfect and no cookie issues like new members always have with PP. I have only been using VBA a couple of weeks but couldn't feature going back. If anyone is interested I have a copy of PP I wish I could sell. :)

Brian
December 31st, 2004, 12:34 AM
You want him to spend time elaborating or coding ;)
Exactly... I'll post more once it's closer to completion. :)

rbl
December 31st, 2004, 12:35 AM
You want him to spend time elaborating or coding ;)

Zachery, from what I know Brian has a list (http://www.vbadvanced.com/forum/showpost.php?p=23142&postcount=4). Copy-paste is fine ;)

UPDATE: Brian, you beat me by seconds! =)
I can understand that! Keep your secrets!

KW802
December 31st, 2004, 12:37 AM
You want him to spend time elaborating or coding ;).... if the 30+/- items was at least listed then perhaps others won't have to do their own coding and instead can wait for RC3. ;)

EDIT: Of course details wouldn't be needed but at least some generalizations might save me some late nights. :)

StewardManscat
December 31st, 2004, 08:36 AM
Right now Gallery enables me to offer a much more complete site to my users

The topic was "pre sales/member galleries". My issue is in this thread (http://www.vbadvanced.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4281).

I need a dumb simple member experience.

Example: you love the permission system. My hack to that is posted in these forums: short-circuit it. Pictures are either on or off for everybody. Simple.

Max too has problems with Photopost installation, upgades and templates.

I'm talking about member galleries. The products are very different in that respect. It just happens to be the area that is important to my site.

But since another topic has come up....



Originally Posted by Zachery
You want him to spend time elaborating or coding


Exactly... I'll post more once it's closer to completion.


This was a last straw for me. I inquired about a thumbnail scrollbar early in the game (it's one of the more obvious differences in features). Wish I could find the message now, Brian's response was something to the tune of "not a difficult hack".

Indeed it wasn't. When I was done I sent Brian a note regarding some things I noticed in the course of the hack. He replied with "it's done in RC3".

Why would I spend my time hacking something that will be in the next release? Because there is no list here of possible features or timeframe. So now I will take my cue from CongSoft, and wait until it's done and released.

It seems Gallery provides no way for me to plan resources, or make decisions on my own. I have no clue what might be in the next release, or when it might come out.

Please don't crash down on me about the dangers and difficulties of posting features and timeframes. I have some (24 years) experience in software development.

A balance would be helpful: between dead silence and gross optimism there is a rough idea of what's planned. Brian will be damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. So be damned, but try to prevent us from focusing on what you will render obsolete in the next release.

Or not. You may have your reasons for silence and I'm not upset over it. It's the way vbadvanced is, and as I said, I'll be here making a nusiance of myself when the product is ready. It is theoretically a better solution, and for many sites now, practically a better solution.

But not, at this time, for adult/member sites. To see this, visit stripperweb (in the thread referenced above), and imagine a site with thousands of members. The page would take all day to load, and there's no easy way to browse.


I'd like to know how you can say twice the features. At the moment, vBa Gallery lacks a few features that PP has, but certainly not twice as many. vBa Gallery also has many features that PP doesn't offer, and RC3 will have about 30 new options/features as well.


Remember Brian, only you know about those 30 features.

Far as I can tell, the benefits and features of gallery are largely fallout from total integration with vb. List only those that are germaine to a photo gallery, and the list is much smaller. Think of it as a compliment: Photopost has been around six times twice as long as gallery, and only has twice the features.

I recommend gallery to anyone cruising the presales forum. There is no better solution for a vb site: solid product, good support, growing feature set, superb integration.

But if you are coming from Photopost, and member galleries are important to your site, be advised that gallery has no intrinsic way of handling them like Photopost, it is not obvious from the sale pitch and demo, and you have yourself a situation. There is no feedback on this site about how, if, or when your solution may come.

I love this place. It's fun. Hell, I was so excited I sent Brian a bonus. But two weeks later, I don't have a gallery, and I'm spending my time coding missing features or pontificating in gallery forums instead of improving my site. Yesterday I installed the Photopost upgrade for vb integration. Poof: everything I want for the members is there and done.

When gallery is ready, I'll be back for what I, as a webmaster, want.

Regs
December 31st, 2004, 09:59 AM
May I ask what the point of that was?

I can understand exactly why Brian is being mum about certain things... do you not find it a little more than a coincidense that photopost has suddenly shifted gears towards vB3 enhancement/integration?

Take a pill. It's the holiday season.

It's RC software that is pretty damn good as is. Your rant is more than a little insulting - noone put a gun to your head to buy/use it.

Hopefully you have a better year in 2005.

Cheers,

~Regs.

ConqSoft
December 31st, 2004, 10:03 AM
I think it may be just that a lot of people who are switching from PhotoPost to Gallery don't use the Member Gallery feature as extensively as some of us. Until recently, I didn't even HAVE any other "public" categories for people to upload photos into. They just had, and managed, their own Member Galleries.

Regs
December 31st, 2004, 10:56 AM
So wouldn't that be your fault for not scoping out the software well before purchasing and making the switch?

If photopost features are so great and important to you then why even contemplate a switch? Seriously, think about that one.

You have a developer here who listens and is very helpful when people ask questions. RC2 was released how long ago? 3 weeks? And it's what time of year?

Cheers,

~Regs.

ConqSoft
December 31st, 2004, 12:06 PM
If you'll notice, *I* started this thread, before I prchased, already inquiring about the Member Galleries. You can only scope out so much from the user's side. You have to buy it and check it out to be sure.

Do you see me saying I regret buying Gallery? Do you see me asking for a refund? $59 is pocket change.

Like I said, Gallery will get there.

Brian
December 31st, 2004, 01:42 PM
I really don't find Steward's post insulting or in any way demeaning. In fact, it helps me to know what features are a 'must have' for those that wish to switch from PhotoPost. The only complaint I had about any of his posts was that he said vBa Gallery has half as many features as PP, which isn't the case. Both products have options in which the other is lacking and as of right now PP probably does have a greater number of options / features, but it's certainly not twice as many. Also, (as has been said) vBa Gallery has only been out for three weeks.

Why would I spend my time hacking something that will be in the next release? Because there is no list here of possible features or timeframe. So now I will take my cue from CongSoft, and wait until it's done and released.

It seems Gallery provides no way for me to plan resources, or make decisions on my own. I have no clue what might be in the next release, or when it might come out.

Ok, valid point there.

A balance would be helpful: between dead silence and gross optimism there is a rough idea of what's planned. Brian will be damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. So be damned, but try to prevent us from focusing on what you will render obsolete in the next release.
Exactly. If I don't post what I have in mind, then some people may waste their time trying to hack it in or decide to use another product because the current version is lacking a feature and they weren't aware that it would be available soon. On the other side, if I do post a proposed feature list and some features don't make it into that version for whatever reason, then it's guaranteed that someone will be upset because they thought that feature was going to be there. As with many things in this business, it's a double-edged sword. I suppose I'll check the other side of the sword to see how sharp it is right now though. ;)

Here is a proposed list of additional features / options for RC3. Keep in mind that for one reason or another some features may not make it, and that others not listed here will probably be added as well.

Option to have the number of images displayed in categories that users don't have permission to access (helps guests to realize that the gallery is not empty and may entice them to register, or become paid members).
Better support for GD1.
Option to open full size (original) images in a new window displaying just the image and nothing more.
Filmstrip of images on the 'showimage.php' page to allow you to display the thumbnails of X previous/next images.
Option for users to password protect their categories.
Record IP addresses with images.
Moderate images from the user side (basically the same as vBa Links Directory).
Image Notes field added to the user side when editing an image for mods & admins.
Enhanced Scan Database option in the Maintenance section.
Upload limit per day - set per usergroup, limits number of daily uploads.
Watermarking images per-category and more default options that may be changed on a per-category basis.
Option to watermark images on the fly rather than permanently.
Maintenance option to watermark un-watermarked images.
'Remove' link with the thumbnail on favorites/subscriptions pages.
Option to increase the user's postcount for uploaded images.
New permission to allow users to view thumbnails, but not full-sized images.
Option to allow users to delete categories which they have created.
Replace Image option when editing image.
Spider Friendly URLs.
User's personal categories on the 1st page of the 'Find all images by this user' page.
New table for exif info on images so this info can be gathered with the image query rather than with the exif() function. Probably a maintenance option to allow you to re-gather this info as well.
Permissions option for cansendecard.
NetPBM Support.
Zip Uploads.
Mass move images from one category to another.
Add filesize and dimensions to the moderation approval page.
Option to .htaccess protect your gallery/files folder.
[IMG], <img>, and link code generator on the showimage.php page.
'View Allowed Extensions' link on the upload.php page to show allowed extensions for each category.
Option to set the number of categories displayed per page.
Options to set a category as a 'Members Category' in which any images uploaded to that category will automatically be placed in a folder named after that user.
General optimization.


Again, this is NOT a definitive list for RC3. While most of these options should make it into the next release, some undoubtedly will not. As for a timeframe on it's release, that's next to impossible to estimate. Some things will take longer than expected as one feature will cause a problem with another, a method I have in mind to do something may not work as well as I expect, and etc. I will say howerver that I am trying to set aside as much of next week as possible to work on these things.

ConqSoft
December 31st, 2004, 01:47 PM
Brian,

Excellent! Thanks for the update.

While all the proposed changes are great, the last three are the ones I really want. :D

Regs
December 31st, 2004, 03:03 PM
ConqSoft,

Apologies for coming off as ranting specifically at you... I was still would up a little from the other poster I was addressing.

I just hate to see posts like he did when it is apparent that Brian is one of the very few vB hack/enhancement authors that go about things the right way.

"the final straw" bit was what I found unnecessary considering the time of year.

Cheers,

~Regs.

StewardManscat
January 1st, 2005, 10:18 AM
Apologies to all for any public offense I have caused.

I have a quirky wit: I know it doesn't always read well for some.

ConqSoft, I always admired people with your kind of patience.

Perhaps it will help if I explain the I snatched up the gallery software without bothering to view the demo or read the forums because $60 is peanuts and I already know vbadvanced produces top-notch software. I would buy it just to read the code. Yes, I am the kind of nerd that reads code.

I have the luxury of an existing site and working gallery so there's no rush. I jumped all over the place, trying hacks and mods, testing and templating. For me, getting my hands dirty is the only way to really know how software works.

After a week I sent Brian a bottle via paypal, just to express my admiration and say thanks.

"A last straw for me" just means that was the point where I decided this release of the gallery wasn't ready for my site, and my evaluation period ended.

You will also find in my messages: "I love this place... I recommend this software... I am not upset..." etc. I am not going away. Unless Brian fires me, I'll be back, hacking, asking questions, sharing what I can, and being my brutally frank self.

Something else here: gallery is central to my site, and my livelihood. This is an issue of vital concern. I already know there will be no other choice for me: gallery is going to be the best. So I am motivated to express all my concerns, and provide feedback on what I see as the issues.

All of us are webmasters, forum owners and moderators, so we all know how difficult it is to express ourselves perfectly in posts, or understand others without fail. It's a kindess to save personal opinions and flaming for private messages: so someone reading the thread later can spot the issues and not drown in personalities.

RC2 had two specific weaknesses that stopped the show for me: member galleries and no release plan. I have to say that. Once again, I apologize for the wording, timing, phrasing and whatever else was offensive. Sincerely.

Okay so "twice as many features" was definitely an expression. I didn't count. But I stand by the sentiment. It was perhaps better left as "Photopost is the more mature product". The Photopost published feature set is far shorter than what it actually does, and these can only be discovered slowly, during an implementation, coming from a 'member-centric' site. Details are not important to 100% vb sites. My site, and other potential Photopost converts, is a hybrid.

I have every confidence that gallery will blast the socks off Photopost

It may even happen in RC3.

Once again, my apologies to the offended party.

Finally. Brain. Please. I am grateful you took the time to release a plan, that is an enormous help. But you have left out the timeframe. The same (damned if you do, damned if you don't) argument applies. I have no idea if you are thinking three, thirty-three, or three hundred. Days, weeks or months. I don't really care how wide or far from the mark the actual delivery date is, that is simply a fact of life in software development.

A rough idea will help me allocate my resources in the coming months.

Brian
January 1st, 2005, 11:23 AM
Finally. Brain. Please. I am grateful you took the time to release a plan, that is an enormous help. But you have left out the timeframe. The same (damned if you do, damned if you don't) argument applies. I have no idea if you are thinking three, thirty-three, or three hundred. Days, weeks or months. I don't really care how wide or far from the mark the actual delivery date is, that is simply a fact of life in software development.
As I'm sure you understand, estimating a time frame for things like this is next to impossible. If things go as planned, I don't have too many problems, and I have as much time to work on things as I would like, then I would say that the next release should come within two weeks.

StewardManscat
January 1st, 2005, 11:58 AM
Estimating is easy. Meeting the estimate is hard! But that is great, thank you. It tells me it probably won't be six months away, and so I will not continue with Photopost development at this time. My decision, my risk, no skin off you.

Thank you for a prompt and helpful reply.

Brian
January 1st, 2005, 12:32 PM
Estimating is easy. Meeting the estimate is hard!

Always gotta get technical, huh? :p

wildondallas
January 15th, 2005, 02:36 PM
I am impressed with the galler in the early stages, however as many others I have decided to stick with photopost for now as well. However, I am anxious for the gallery to mature, and for my vb websites will with no doubt be using it in the near future verses photopost.

Keep up the good work !

iml
January 20th, 2005, 01:05 AM
I decided to bail on PP for several reasons.

One, their support isn't really that great.

In addition, several years ago, I brought a major security hole to their attention and the owner basically told me it wasn't a security problem and blew me off.

The last few times I have contacted them about some login issues to their support section they were extremely rude.

In addition, if you don't continue to pay their annual fee you lose access to even download the last version available on your annual subscription. If you couple that with all the bug fix and security releases they do so often it is much more of a hassle to run a PP site than it is worth IMO.

Even though I don't think vba gallery is quite there yet with the feature set, I am hoping the PP deficiencies aren't there either. I steer people clear of PP because of the company's/developer's attitude.

Bottom line...doesn't matter how good your product is (or how good you think it is), if you have crappy service and/or you are an ahole, your product sux for all practical purposes and people will move on down the road to the next product.

...may vba gallery be everything that PP never was and never will be...

Brian
January 20th, 2005, 09:58 AM
In addition, several years ago, I brought a major security hole to their attention and the owner basically told me it wasn't a security problem and blew me off.
You really want to see something scary for PP users?
http://www.securiteam.com/unixfocus/5BP0U00CBI.html

wildondallas
January 27th, 2005, 01:47 AM
Im tired and cranky decided not to post.....lol

KW802
January 27th, 2005, 10:44 AM
Im tired and cranky decided not to post.....lolDon't forget that some people have instant subscriptions turned on. ;)

rbl
January 27th, 2005, 11:03 AM
Yup... I received one of those from another thread with the most wonderful, joyful, heart warming text about Gallery and a pirated copy...
Now that I think of it, it was from this thread but the user deleted his post.

Lizard King
January 27th, 2005, 11:12 AM
Is there any eta about the new version coming up ?
I am planning to buy vbagallery monday or tuesday but if the new version eta is soon I can hang out one more week cause I don't want to upgrade within a week or 2 :)

Brian
January 27th, 2005, 12:05 PM
*Most likely* sometime next week. :)

PhoenixDown21
January 30th, 2005, 12:27 AM
Doh,... just saw this and was in the process of upgrading lol. I'll wait.